ShipSpotting.com Forum
Shipspotters all over the world => Shipping News and information => Topic started by: libertyshiplad on May 08, 2015, 07:45:55 PM
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Now and again smaller vessels (around 2000 tons) anchor in the English Channel in Hythe Bay,either sheltering or awaiting orders.
What surprises me is that many do not display the ball or anchor light ,one even at anchor for 3 days with all navigation lights on permanently as though under way.
Don't they get reported by Coastguard or others.
Surely a serious offence,or maybe not any more!
Wondering just how commonplace this is?
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It may be the case that they are relying on combined AIS and radar displays which show vessel alongside/anchored or under way status, and which commercial vessels increasingly seem to swear by . . .
There probably aren't enough coasties left to report anything to anyone . . . I don't know if there's a formal structure pf penalties, have to find out!
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Plain and simple,,, TOO LOW TRAINING STANDARD !!!!
still today as ever,,black ball for anchor daylight,,1 anchor fwd for under 50m and two lights over 50m ,one each fwd/aft,,whereby the aft is higher then the fwd light
that,s it.
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Thanks for the replies.
So it's as simple as that then Captain Ted,a bit alarming really.
Could not find anything about penalties for non -compliance,suppose there are none until an accident happens.
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Yeah well
penalties,, does not help much,, it is more about standards,,and those are in the basement and one deck lower !!!!!
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The problem is that nobody is really bothered. There is no value any more and its a downward spiral. When you have a situation where the only factor is the cost of the "seaman" so that the cheapest always prevail, you have to remember that most of those cheap seaman are not there because they want to be, they're there solely for the money and may well hate the job and certainly have no enthusiasm to do it well. They do just enough to get by and nothing more.
The same is also the case in road transport these days. The better wages offered being a truck driver compared to the standard minimum wage job that is now the order of the day both in Europe and North America mean that many unsuitable people have trained to become truck drivers, they're generally useless at the job because they don't want to do it, they just want the extra money. All the old ways of doing things that used to go with the job are not adopted by these new comers, its dog eat dog and another downward spiral. These days the average driver would rather film another driver on his iphone having trouble backing in to a loading dock or parking space and upload it to facebook, rather than get out and help watch him in. As I said to start with, everything has turned in to an "I'm alright Jack" type situation with no thought to others and certainly no pride in the job. I imagine the same is also the case in many other industries.
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And if some of the professional mariners aren't bad enough, the recreational boaters are even worse. Earlier this month I watched as the 190 foot tug RESOLVE PIONEER attempted to approach the Ballard Locks here in Seattle (where large vessels generally enter first). In its way, sitting right smack dab in the middle of the channel under a railroad drawbridge was a 25 foot cabin cruiser also waiting for the locks.
First the lock master came over the loudspeaker to state that smaller vessels must clear the main channel for larger ones, and in response the boater did nothing.
Next, the tug took things into its own hands and properly sounded a quiet, but clear, five short blast danger signal. The boater still did nothing.
So again, the lock master took control and yelled over the loudspeaker "Look behind you!" Finally the boater took heed, and promptly sprinted his boat out of the channel.
Just ridiculous.
Kind Regards,
Kyle
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Seems to me that standards of seamanship..have been slipping for at least the past three decades..once national flag carriers such as Australia ,Norway,Britain and many more first world countries had well paid ,and fully trained seaman..I myself went through 6 years of training to be an A.B..fully competant in everything from splicing wire rope to being mud pilot at a moments notice..the rot set in when financial arguements outweighed common sense and flagging out was the in-thing..to the dismay and loss of lively hoods for many fine sailors..and not only "down below'..the amount of RAC,s(Radar Assisted Collisions) by unqualified Third mates and Masters is yet another nail in the coffin of the professional Seaman..(a steady light you see in front-full ahead and ram the ....)
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hi Kyle
don't bring me on the boaters/sailing vessels issue.
I say only one thing.
Down in Florida we call them WFAI,s = Wind Assisted F.....g Idiots
that has a reason. Totally unregulated and big ships still today have to give
way to them !!!!!! Also when that is in channels and bridges area not the case, because inland rules overrule all else.
But nevertheless the causes,,when ANYONE can walk into a boat dealership buys a 50-60' or whatever size boat and 5 minutes later can cruise the waters without any schooling or courses to do so,,then definitely something is wrong with the system !!!
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Can someone please comment...I was looking at a number of photos yesterday of the Industrial Kennedy under tow off Lerwick. Would she be technically "Not Under Command" whilst being towed ( apparent engine failure )and should she have the two black balls hoisted - its over fifty years since I last had to know this but the mists of time etc.. Reference rules of the road Nicholls's Nautical Knowledge 1959
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Hi Anthony
She is then a vessel towed,, so the NOC does not apply to that situation !!!!
The towing lights as a unit (Tug/ship/) then have to be shown as outlined in the COLREGS
The Tug however could, if needed show beside towing lights also restricted maneuverability !!
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Hi Captain Ted,
Thanks for your reply, that explains the situation and I now can see the reason, I assume in day time only the tug would carry an under-tow signal, if more than one tug is used and both have a towing line connected to the stranded vessel would both towing vessels be required to indicate they are towing?
Kindest Regards Tonypad
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Captain Ted : It is fairly universal worldwide- we get people in small boats or stand up paddle boarders in the shipping channel here in Auckland as well. Presumably in this photo they think the cruise ship can see them and won't run them over. Even assuming they have no idea of Maritime rules, you would think that basic common sense would suggest that might is right ?
http://www.shipspotting.com/gallery/photo.php?lid=2206716
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@ Anthony,,correct
day signal..and all the tugs involved would show tow signals
@Nigel
there is no common sense for them. !!! I by myself made a stop and than a astern
full 1/4 mile before passing in Tampa Bay under the bridge because someone decided to anchor under the bridge in the middle of the fairway and goes fishing !!!!!
Did not move on blasting the horn 5 times ,,a few times,,,no reply when we called on
VHF,, and so on. But was shouting up to us when we finally passed that we inconvenienced him !!!
It is just incredible what happens out there. I was with my present ship , UBC Tampico, 5 times !!!! controlled by port state controls (MOU) in ports in the last 6 month. Pleasure crafts are not controlled whatsoever !!!!!
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Now and again smaller vessels (around 2000 tons) anchor in the English Channel in Hythe Bay,either sheltering or awaiting orders.
What surprises me is that many do not display the ball or anchor light ,one even at anchor for 3 days with all navigation lights on permanently as though under way.
Don't they get reported by Coastguard or others.
Surely a serious offence,or maybe not any more!
Wondering just how commonplace this is?
Not an issue in the Margate Roads anchorage. Pass through or near on a regular basis and all ships display both day and night signals.
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Thanks for posts.
So any non-compliance, down to lack of training,interest,little pride and I suppose no real deterrrent.
Sticking to the rules in Margate Roads though,wouldn't have anything to do with the area being within PLA jurisdiction?
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Thanks for posts.
So any non-compliance, down to lack of training,interest,little pride and I suppose no real deterrrent.
Sticking to the rules in Margate Roads though,wouldn't have anything to do with the area being within PLA jurisdiction?
The Margate Roads are not within The Port of London Authority limits nor the Outer Tongue anchorage. Although they do remotely monitor the areas.
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Does not matter where you anchor the rules are world wide same
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I just did wonder if the Port of London Authority would be more likely to enforce the Rules within their area.
Is there a map showing the extent of their area in the Thames Estuary,couldn't seem to find one on their website?
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You have to look under 'harbor (port) limits', in sea charts they are usually always outlined
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Is there a map showing the extent of their area in the Thames Estuary,couldn't seem to find one on their website?
It is here, page 3:
https://www.pla.co.uk/assets/introduction.pdf
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Thanks for the comments,and Davidships extent of PLA area.
Very much like your new "rule" Keith!!