Photographs on this site

[Captain Ted]

Perfect post Cornelia !!!!

[Lukasz Blaszczak]

Thanks for the super post Cornelia, I live far away from the sea and try to visit Hamburg 4-5 times to take a "few pics".
Best regards
Lucas

[pieter melissen]

What I do not understand is some people claiming certain ships as "not interesting" like before by Pieter Melissen. Who decide, what is interesting and what not?

Dear Cornelia, if you quote me, do it correctly, please, I did not say NOT interesting, but HARDLY interesting, referring to the fact that the HANNI is a standard Sietas built feeder of which there are quite a few around. If somebody wants to collect shots of all of these, fine, but seeing the same ship over 200 times, it looks to me like overkill, especially because of the main issue here, which is that the site gets overloaded with photos which in itself are perfect, but of which the ADDED value is questionable. (ADDED value and not the value) It all goes back to the issue of bandwith for which the site has to pay, but which of course is of little relevance since uploading is free of charge.   

[davidships]

I think, PM, you are missing the point.  The purpose of this site is not to provide an illustrated catalogue of the world's ships.  If it was, then a limit of images of the same ship would be logical.  Neither is it the purpose to be a gallery of the world's best ship photos - if it was, then most members would never post anything and 90% of the images would be deleted.

Shipspotting's purpose, as I have always understood it, is to provide a platform where members can show their ship images, for the enjoyment of others, subject only to the "house rules".  Nobody has to look at every photo, every ship, every class or every category and it clear that members (let alone public visitors) have a very wide range of interests.

Do I think that there are too many near-duplicates?  Yes.  But this will not be improved by making more rules, only by the self-restraint of members.  All I would ask is that when posting, members look at what they have already posted and only post a similar view if it is better than their previous ones, especially if it is effectively the same view of the same ship in the same place.

It is not for us to worry too much about bandwidth.  The site-owner/webmaster will no doubt tell us if this becomes an issue of significance.

[echobow]

Hi Pieter,
In reference to your statement concerning the questionable value added to this site by uploading photos of a vessel which is already well depicted like "Hanni", a question arises in my mind: Do you think it is up to us (the far minority of members which are currently involved in this thread) to asses whether a ship's photograph will be considered as a valuable contribution to the site?
Isn't it more likely that each member has a different taste and therefore an individual preferendum while browsing through the uploads?

As for me, I'm not much interested in black-and-white photographs from the past, but I noticed that there are others for which the shots from the bygone era have a high relevance, partly because they connect personal memories with certain vessels or places. That's fine for me, I usually skip the "old shots" and rather glance at the colourfull contemporary images.

But since nearly everyone has different favs and liking, I think it is in fact far too general to say that another shot of a ship like "Hanni" won't mean an added value to the site. The expression "added value" is in my opinion hardly more than a blank phrase since it is fixed to the perception that a "valuable" photograph has to stick out and moreover derives its appreciation from the assessment of a (small) group of members with its own classification of what is an "added value" and what ain't.

That is just my opinion, I hope you understand the point I wanted to make,
Regards, David

[pieter melissen]

Davidships

First you say I am missing the point, and then you make a plea for self restraint, which is exactly my point....

if you care to read my earlier posts.

[pieter melissen]

Echobow, to me it is largely related to the law of diminishing returns, the more shots of a specific ship are going to be posted, the smaller the added value of a shot becomes. I agree that each contributor/reader/member is entitled to his/her personal preferences or taste. There are several categories of ships where I never open a single shot, but others have my keen interest. But also there I like to see restraint, and not to have see the same ship (by different photographers) on a very regular basis. And again, and I am not advocate for the site owner, but there is the issue of bandwith which has to be paid for.   

[davidships]

Agreed, PM.  I was conflating two issues - those who favour restrictions (not you, but many others in this thread) and your concept of "added value".  On this site added value is not to the site itself, but to the viewer.  Only an exact duplicate can have zero added value (and indeed they are banned), the rest is subjective. 

[pieter melissen]

Agreed, PM.  I was conflating two issues - those who favour restrictions (not you, but many others in this thread) and your concept of "added value".  On this site added value is not to the site itself, but to the viewer.  Only an exact duplicate can have zero added value (and indeed they are banned), the rest is subjective. 

David, the last couple of days I have been in the process of critically going through my digital ship shots from the last three years. In the interest of (external) hard disk space, I have deleted quite a few mainly because they were of the same ship and shot some seconds after each other, or because I made better shots of the same ship on a later date. The reason my deletion is that they do not represent added value to my, altohugh they are technically speaking completely different. I also shoot at race tracks and after a weekend and 5-10000 shots futher I delete about 80-90%, because those shots produce no added value, I am just looking for one or two good shots. (A professional friend of mine says that after a weekend the "delete"button on has computer has RSI) This is sort of representative for my approach to Shipspotting. A couple of good shots of a ship is sufficient for me. That the site has been set up to allow posters all over the world to post as many shots as they want, has now resulted in the sort of discussions that the thread starter mentioned in the first place. 

[simonwp]

Having lit the touch paper I've been interested to read the comments of other without joining in. However a particular issue has prompted me to post again.

Of the 1000 or so photographs I've posted over the past few weeks, I've had a handful of deletions. Most of these were fair enough, although there were a couple of bizarre one's.

One shot of the vehicle carrier BESS was deleted because the hull colour was incorrect, it should have been green. Well I've looked and looked at it, and had a couple of others look at it, and it sure as hell looks green to us!!!!

Another was deleted because it was too dark. It was taken in bright sunshine. It wasn't the best shot as there was a lot of background, but it certainly wasn't too dark.

However, that's not the point I wanted to make. It's regarding the comments that sometimes accompany the deletions. I know that many admins do not have English as a first language, and so it's not easy for them, but some of the comments are quite intimidating and discouraging. I'm thick skinned enough for it not to bother me, but if I was a new poster, or a younger poster just finding their way in the hobby, I would find the comments off putting.

For example, instead of putting "Poor Quality image", something along the lines of "This image would benefit from.........", or "would have been better with.....", something that helps the photographer to improve, and still makes them feel their photographs are wanted.

[Captain Ted]

@ Pieter and others

I can,t follow your/some arguments,, this website allowed us and bandwidth WHAT ??

Come on,,who profits daily from the posters/members ? They make money with our pictures
and I have to be thankfull ?,, I think, if at all,  that should may be the other way around.

and bandwidth,, well if they want to have daily upload of 500 and more pictures then I can only suggest get a better bandwidth, but not limit me by not posting at all as seems to be some  argument also,, Picture on the site already,,delete mine ?  and who decides which 5 picture of each ship can stay.
I they would to do that,, only the 5 best pictures, then they can darn well buy them from me but not get them for free anymore when I have to compete with 1000th of spotters por slots of 5 pictures

and added value,,what means that,, If I go by that the ships crest section should be deleted right now. Or for that matter a few other sections we have here.
But certainly there is added value for some members who like ships crests.

It comes own to the personal view and what one likes,,but not a added value !!!


brgds
capt ted
  

[Jens Boldt]

Theo, I couldn't agree more! Well said

[Cornelia Klier]

Very well said Capt. Ted, I could not have said it better. Also, I wonder, what that arguement "bandwidth" should be good for. There has never been a problem with it, nowhere mentioned and it would be very unfair to use this term just to give the own arguements (to get the own head through the wall better) more power.

I think, it is allright the way it is now and I believe as well, that the admin team as well as owners will find a solution, if any problem comes up with this, so we should not panic but enjoy this site the way it is now. And, it is also needed to have respect for preferrences of other people's choices because there is not really any objective way, how you can judge what is value and what not, because it is up to personal preferrences. I for example rather perfer to see 10 photos of "Hanni" per day - and additionally of her sisters, than even one black/white photo of an era when I was not even born. It is also up to personal preferrences, please do not forget this and we are all different, which is very well represented on this site, with all these various categories!

greetings,

Cornelia

[Captain Ted]

@ Cornelia
well said also !!!
Seems to me like too much individuals who would like to put their "view" stamp on the whole site.  Lets hope that common sense prevails,,but I am afraid .......

capt ted

[itsfoto]

For me there can be no doubt whatsoever that Simon, Pieter and quite a few others, who occasionally stick there neck out to highlight what they conceive as problems or shortcomings with this site, are absolutely serious about it and deserve to be met with respect. They may be wrong or they may be right, but shouting them down is not the right way to respond. Hinting that "common sense" may not be theirs, for example, is neither fair nor acceptable. It's ok to say I don't agree. It's not ok to say you are daft.
Uwe