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Author Topic: Liverpool Cruises  (Read 8689 times)
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Allan RO
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« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2012, 07:46:14 pm »

Hi Bob

Very simple, subsidies, legal, illegal or ignored.  One rule for one, one rule for another.

I dont think I ever said Polish yards were particularly efficient but they could turn out a box boat or a car carrier as quickly as anyone else, and also specialist chemical tankers with stainless steel tanks and fittings with very few worldwide builders. The subsidies the yards received kept thousands in work.  These people are presumably no longer in work, either in Poland - or anywhere else in Europe where they have become economic migrants in search of work.  So the government either pays subsidies to keep them in work and produce someting worthwhile, or they sit on their backsides with no work and the government still has to pay out, but nothing is produced. Logic ?  I think not.

So the turnround terminal built with subsidies (not yet paid back) may reduce by a small amount the unemployment in Scouseland, but if it grows, as is the intention, then Southampton may well lose out and jobs will be lost from terminals not built with the aid of subsidies - so where is the fairness in that ?

Allan
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Robert Smith
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« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2012, 09:30:28 pm »

Judging by their cars' licenceplates most of these workers are now involved in the  construction of the Rotterdam Maasvlakte extension....and a bit more over here !
And who'll be involved in the construction of this Liverpool cruise terminal ?

Brgds,
Robert.

 Grin



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Kelvin Davies
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« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2012, 06:15:39 am »

Allan,
Stop bleating about subsidies not yet repaid.
As the government & Liverpool City Council have agreed a repayment schedule, this is now a loan.
When you get a mortgage for your house, the bank allow you full use of the house even while you are still repaying the loan!
Incidentally, the amount to be repaid etc was determined by an independent firm of consultants employed by the government, so the politicians were kept out of it.
Now; who is going to answer my question re the huge costs for upgrading the railway infrastructure to allow improvements to Southampton container movements?
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ChasB46
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« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2012, 08:35:21 am »

Hi Kelvin,As Liverpool paying by instalments..  then its 12.6m.  I was under the impression that the upgrade,(70m) paid for by Network Rail/rail passengers and ABP Southampton usage charge(6m or 3 per box for 8years .. whether rail or road, whichever is the greater), was not for the benefit of Southampton container port but to take 50,000 lorry journeys of the roads especially A34 to the Midlands, reduce the cost of the transport / customer end prices, reduce carbon emissions by 76%. Incidentally/associated to include upgrade rail passing points/alternative routes re extra freight to also speed up passenger trains previously blocked by extra trains carrying small boxes. Saving the economy 10bn annually, (so more money in our pockets to cruise out of Liverpool). Incidentally the project came in at 10 under budget.
I'm all for Liverpool taking 3000 passengers per ship, the cars and associated coaches off Southampton roads so I can get to Calshot and catch up with you again, brakes permitting.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2012, 08:48:43 am by ChasB46 » Report to moderator   Logged
BobS
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« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2012, 09:36:51 am »

Before or in case we start getting carried away with this "get it off the roads onto rail" thing, it should be borne in mind that doubling the amount of freight currently carried by rail would make less than a one percent reduction in the number of truck journeys on the roads.
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Allan RO
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« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2012, 02:52:34 pm »

Hi Bob

I can't wait to see the gridlock on the A13 when Thames Gateway is fully operational, all those Cobelfret trucks and 40' containers........methinks not a place to go.

Allan
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BobS
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« Reply #21 on: June 01, 2012, 03:34:33 pm »

Allan,
I doubt that it will make enough difference for anyone to notice!
Anyway, there is talk about a new, outer, London Orbital motorway, with a river crossing in Gravesend Reach.
It is possible, though, that with the Gateway open and the economy still in recession, you'll find the M271 a lot quieter as Southampton loses box traffic to the new terminal that is nearer the capital!
BTW: I took a cruise from So'ton last month. Getting down there to catch the boat was the least hassle-free bit of the trip. I disembarked in Greenock and took the train home. No bother!
The next cruise is from Dover (just down the road) and, hopefully, the one after that will be from the new termnal at Greenwich - right on my doorstep.
I am sure Scousers, Mancunians and many people from North of Watford Gap will be welcoming the new Liddypool cruise terminal and will be giving not a jot about how it was financed.
Cheers
Bob
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Allan RO
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« Reply #22 on: June 01, 2012, 08:25:51 pm »

Bob

You've probably hit the nail on the head, no one really gives a stuff..... except the poor sods that will be losing their jobs.

And one other thought too, London Gateway may be nearer the capital, but as London is a financial and service centre, I doubt many boxes are actually destined there - it is simply an obstacle that has to be navigated around.

Allan

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BobS
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« Reply #23 on: June 01, 2012, 09:28:35 pm »

With around 8 million people living in greater London, all wanting to buy Chinese-made computers, electronic gear and miscellaneous cheap junk from Pound Shops, it is inevitable that a considerable proportion of import boxes are heading for the capital. With all these people, even though they mostly work in banks, shops and offices, London also produces a considerable proportion of what is one of Britains biggest exports in terms of weight - recyclable waste (especially clapped-out Chinese-made computers and the cardboard boxes they originally came in).
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